some observation in MNCF

[John in England]

Thanks for your thoughts Tatjana. You're absolutely right. My thoughts are based on purely information given to me and visits over the years. However, that is pretty thorough and comprehensive. My job as PR officer of our society is to check out the organization to which we donate funds. Dont worry, you are not missing anything here at all.
     With regard to MNCF, I keep in contact with some of the end users as a duty of care, so far I am 100% satisfied.
     I have held this position for some years and have not found scams because we have vetted them well, but have found charities who do not run as "efficiently" as  we had hoped. I think you will find we have been the major benificiary over the past few years. I am happy, so why shouldn't anybody else be ?
    If there are beneficiaries who are wondering how there funds are spent, why don't they do as we do and ASK. Quite simple really. We always get answers.
The remaining members have hung on in there, not for there own good but for the good of the MNCF.
     Don't "knock" the people doing good work, "knock" those that do nothing.  I say the same to people in the UK, "if you have a lot to say and want to run the society, run for committee"
 When we formed the Wessex Anglo Filipino Society in 2001, many wanted to be involved because they thought they would benefit financially. After a year or so they found this wasn't the case and left the committee or drifted away.  Sometimes people can't get their head around a situation where people spend there own time and effort raising money for charity with no recompense for themselves and sadly can only suspect others of wrong doing. We were left with a hardcore of generous organisers (sorry to say only 4 or 5 Filipinos out of a committee of 15) who work tirelessly to run events to raise funds for 3 or 4 charities.
 It is very easy to "snipe" at people understaffed yet doing a good job. Perhaps those that do should get  involved and give their free time to help run the MNCF with no financial benefit to themselves.
   I have many eyes and ears around Naga, some bigger than others. People are more than willing to inform me of anything I may seek. So far, our monies used through MNCF has been 100%. I see no reason to think otherwise.
   In the meantime, while all is good, we will continue to give our vote with our "wallet" and continue to support them.

[nutcracker53]

You got a point there sir John.very well taken. But as far as good accounting practice is concerned, I support the suggestion of Tatjana to put everything in its proper place. Register the entity and have everything documented. I should say get an independent accountant to audit the books..As to the bank manager who opened the account,,what was his basis of opening? If the payee of the funds was an entity he cannot open it without the proper documentation..(SEC registration) Unless the payee was an individual..

[John in England]

Thanks for your comments nutcracker. I appreciate your concerns on the financial "technicalities" and etiquette  of this matter. It seems there are some issues here that go back a long way that I am not a party to.
 I am just happy to report on what I see and hear. So far, I have no reservations whatsoever. If I did, funding would be stopped immediately until the issue was explained or resolved. Over the years in my career I have seen and learnt alot. Not wishing to sound arrogant or as I believe you Filipinos say "yabang", you have to get up very early in the morning to get one over on me.
   Not that I know, but listening to some comments here,  there could be a case of a shortfall  on the administrative etiquette here, but under the cicumstances this could be excused with the "skeleton staff" that  are running this operation to the best of there ability and minimal help. ( my opinion only )
 I would like to acknowledge Tatjana at this stage. Yes, I understand we are not the only benefactors since the formation of the MNCF and I take on board that the funds donated to the needy are not solely donated by ourselves.
     I take the view that if a person paid only 100php to MNCF three years ago he may rightly believe that money may still be held by MNCF, only if the account was totally cleared would they know the money had been used. I welcome and respect your comments.

[tatjana]

 Metobank-Naga Branch Mgr. Who?

We all know that Metrobank is among the topnotch banks in the country. It continous to maintain their slot for  decades. We just wonder what is happening to one of its local branch here. Probably just an exception to the group?

Metrobank has presently  three(3)  Naga City  branches:   Along  Penafrancia Ave ,at Gen Luna, and at  Caceres just don't know which one among  these branches is in question here. However, it  appears there is a deafening silence among the concerned officers here on this particular  case. Probably they were thinking that it is better  this way as the outcry will die a natural death anyway, by just ignoring it.

 My friend BM, you are mistaken. Or is it that you cannot find any good reason yet up to this time  to   cover your ass? Should nothing  still should materialize, I am sorry to state that The problem will be elevated to  dear Head Office. So , we await your full explanation sirs?,  Attention also to the branch operation officer. and the audit group.  Likewise, the  Regional office for Southern Luzon and Bicol.

[John in England]

I take your drift Tatjana. I can help being amused though, that this is just like a minature version of Filipino government politics. Take a step back and start looking at the BIG PICTURE. The good work that this fund does far outweighs any minor commercial indiscretion. We can all find out minor flaws in any process (if there is any).
   In the UK this would come under the phrase "being penny wise and pound foolish" and "it works and if it isn't bust, don't fix it" 

[dune]

I would say Tatjana is right in some way.  And he has all the right to criticize MNCF.

Just to give a clearer background regarding the group before it has evolved into what it is now, let me say the following:

1) MNCF started small. All donors were "posters" of this forum (It was the posters who suggested to create MNCF and donated out from their own pockets). After it's successful pilot activity of gift-giving in Carolina, most of the donors and members decided to pursue it with more activities.  I guess the joy of fulfillment to help is indeed priceless...

2) Since the fund is not kept on a safe place, we decided to open a personal (joined) account (not named after MNCF) just to make sure we can have the audit trail based on the account movement. (Please stop blaming the Branch Manager and how (s)he allowed us to open the account since it was supported with necessary documents required by the bank (Let me repeat--we opened a PERSONAL ACCOUNT -- at least some people like nutcracker have a very clear mindset).  Nothing was illegal, therefore which bank will not accept?

3) For what the MNCF is, on it's present state: I believe MNCF is still not ripe enough to become a full-pledge organization.  Only a few major players are left and therefore unable to compile all the requirements to be able to have the SEC registration -- that's why the activities are limited to paying tuition fees, feeding, gift-giving etc.  Remember, the few "volunteers" are not into the group full-time and registration takes a long process. Volunteers needs to give time and effort (thats the reason I resigned from the group--I cannot give my time and effort -- I salute those who are, until now, able to share their time for the needy's sake). MNCF needs HELP. Please, why don't we do something instead? Nutcracker mentioned about an "independent accountant" -- any volunteers? (so sorry, members are not paid)..

Bottom line is, since Tatjana is very persistent with his delirium, why doesn't he file a complaint or at least audit the group himself? Like John mentioned, try to "step back and look at the big picture".

Frankly, I feel so cheap answering this post since it's really not worth answering.

[John in England]

Nice one Dune. Thank you for filling the voids of information where I couldn't. This certainly ties in with what I already know.
                 I hope this matter is now clarified.
 Dune, I know how you feel entering into this conversation, but don't  as you say "feel cheap".
    You have not lowered yourself to a level. It is a pleasure to have someone who knows the way the fund was founded and can answer the suspicions and cast away the "minor financial etiquette conspiracy" that is now shown to have never existed.
     Shame you're not around to help, they could do with your assistance. Could you not remotely assist with the website for them ?

[felipe]

tatjana, u have a point. but dude, dont u think ur making a mountain out of an ant hill?
ur concerns  (no by laws , constitution , SEC reg. that could open the funds to a possible fraud)
has been allayed already in light of mr. john of england replies.

u 're sounding like u wanna burn down a shelter for lack of building permit.

let them do their good deeds.
im in sure in light of ur sincere concerns and poking, they will now attend to the paper work.

[tatjana]

 Lord John. Ty for your statement that I'm "penny wise and pound foolish". It's your  perogative to say so.
 
However , I can conclude that basing on your  simple logic," just because  up to this date everything is GREAT so  TOMORROW or in the future, EVERYTHING will ALWAYS be GREAT." What kind of logic is that?
That " if it is not Busted, don't Fix it?.. Ha? 
Shouldd you have to wait for the BUST  to erupt before patching up the Cracks?". isn't it a  wise move to face the Music  headon rather than to sweep the dust under the rug?

Lord John, it appears that you are are so inclined for the status quo of the account , rather find other ways  as to regularize it with the bank. There are may people here who can help you with that  by giving their cent's worth of direction  as long as you open to it. This is not that I am here to criticize your group as being unresponsive to others concern.  But they appeared to be all Knowing ( based on their comments here), but the truth is that  they have very limited knowledge of handling this business in the first place. Harsh to say that but... "Ignoramus" is the better way of saying it.

Why don't your BM of the bank help you out  on this as it is not only his business, but  his ever  DUTY to his clients?.  A good customer care does not stop after the capture of the account , but rather  to relish the good relations and rapport to every banlk client continoiusly in order to maintain the business. I am never a marketing person but I know the business of these BMs,who incidentally are now called "Business Managers", rather than branch managers, because of their Now "Marketing thrust" Goals. or solicitation of accounts.

I am sorry to say that Lord John, that because of this persistent "fluidity " status of the account, you have to travel to  come to the country , maybe yearly just to" watch" over the backs of those people whom you have entrusted your funds with. ( although, " no problems so far" ).
 But are the donors, especially those outside your group, well  appraised of all  your travels? Isn't it Just  a mere JUNKET?, using other peoples' Funds? Good for you sir, you have these PERKS, but is this allowed by whom?  This is a very grave concern here. You mean to say that because you are very so caring on these donor's funds .all those working on these MNCF fund are mere "Volunteers", so no compensations "GRATIS ET AMORE".. BUT.. BUt Except  Sir John who have all tthe controls on the fund as to  all his whims and Caprices

.How much is the  COST on all  your travels, halfway around the globe? I can surmise its a minimum of $1,500, / travel., or higher if to include other incidentals, like hotel, local transport . and miscellaneous items, Do you have a formal prior approval from the donors?  Unless perhaps,  you are doing it out of  your own personal pocket, which I doubt.

The cost per travel, is enough to cover for two(2)

[tatjana]

Continue..
The cost per travel/year is enough to cover a two (2) year college scholarship locally.
 I envy you sir John , you are using these supposed Country inspection/ monitoring/ personall audit on the MNCF fund just to justify  your junkets. This is  really a much earned PERKS for your position here.! YOu are much better off than these EXecutives in Makati who can barely go out of the country on thier own , unless thru  their Bonus funds, huh?

Good day sir>

[tatjana]

 HI Mr, Dune,

 You are so advance  to call me "In delirium".  Not as yet , in the  future , as all of us will reach that stage anyway.

You considered yourself  "cheap," just because you entered into these?. But  didn't you   stated the fact that you were then a former "OFFICER?", of MNCF?. But now resigned, and therefore you have divested or been  relieved of your resposibility?.
How about your concern as to the account's movements? You very well mentrioned that you have not been in touched since your resignation, But  as a former "officer", isn't it your duty to have a proper turn over of  resposibility before your exit?. Or is this is all the way officers of MNCF behave?,
 They could just raise their arms and say " I QUIT"  at anytime?.  My God! this is the reason of all the mess! Nobody in particular  is  now in formal charge of  the house. By the way, you guys didn't have any formal election of officers as there was no election  anyway then.  You personally imposed upon yourselves as who will  assume  any post desired at his/ her liking.  Hey! this is not your personal funds . It is the Peoples' money... Why did you not informe the people that  acertain Dune is Quitting? so they could be well advised as to their further participation? You guys discontinue the posts on the MNCF unlilaterlly, as if you  own the funds, not minding all those donors. Only those supposed "INs" in the inner circles of MNCF have access to information. This is stupidity.!

Based on previous info, some reasons for the others  quitting is that they cannnot stomach the way some officers are pushing their wayto others.  Worst, a woman member  from the  USA then was suspected of being untrustworthy so, some have altogether ganged on her and cast doubts on her trustworthyness. This was the reason for her resignation.  Although those were only their suspicions,but was  never proven on any bad instances cited.

So  it is clear enough that  funds were deposited in PRIVATE account  even without any authorization  , because "the house was not yet in orther that time". Until then it is still in this account even after all these years?  Does these donors know anything about it?Was there any posts or letters to those concern to this effect?.  Everyone is in limbo.

[John in England]

Tatjana, you seem to be lashing out at everyone because you have had the wind taken out of your sails regarding the MNCF bank account.

I notice now you have taken an interest in myself.

 I would not normally answer such rantings, but since this is an open forum, I am happy to let you have any information I can. After all as I said earlier, some people can't grasp the concept of charity, the fact that some of us wish to help and give our time for others who are more needy than ourselves, with no payment for our time devoted to it.

Fact One: My trips to Naga do not cost the society or donors even one peso.

Fact Two: You fall far short on your estimates for our travel costs.
        eg. all travel costs for my wife, two daughters and myself are about £2500 / 250,000php Our accomodation costs £600 / 60,000 php Spending money about £1500 / 150,000php
I earn my money and I choose how  I spend my money. That is my business alone. If I should want to be ripped off and travel first class I can. I don't, but could if I wished.

Fact Three: I pay every penny for the above, as I tie it in with my holiday to see my wife's family and deal with other business matters I may have in the Naga area. So your "doubt" is wrong. Don't judge me by your own standards. There, ironically is a joke or pun  in that last sentence, but only those that know me would understand !
Incidentally, I am also a donor to these funds in the UK.

 Fact Four: Yes, you may envy me. Admittedly, I was born into a "well off" family, was fortunate to have a very good education. Have travelled the world extensively, been successfull in several businesses. I am handsome, look alot younger than my 48 years, I really don't need to work. My beautiful Filipina wife is also my best friend, I have two beautiful teenage daughters who are progressing well in their studies and their own futures look very promising. So far, thank god, our health is good.  We want for nothing.
 
In fact, if I was to believe in re-incarnation, I would want to come back into this world as myself !

Fact Five: I became aware of the MNCF through my visits and dealings with Naga. It is an organisation I can visit when I am in Naga with only donating my own time and from my holiday and some money to the cause.

Fact Six: As I said, the society donates to three or four charities in the Philippines, strangely this one is the only one that has provoked an adverse reaction  from any person.

Fact Seven: I don't know your background Tatjana, but you seem to be very bitter at everyone that is trying to help the needy. Perhaps you should get out more. Tell you what, give me your contact details and the next time I am in Naga I'll invite you for a meal, (on me) I can explain more fully my business and more particularly my charity work.

   Sorry, but I don't know your gender and I am not familiar with your name, if you are female the invitation extends to your partner.

[dune]

  Hilarious! 

I wonder why we even need to answer Tatjana (sisay ka man baga)? Maybe it's time for Tatjana to prove what he's capable of... Perhaps, put your (you and whoever you say "we" if there is such) words into action?




He who conceals his hatred has lying lips, and whoever spreads slander is a fool.
Prv 10:18

[tatjana]

How insensitive can you be Mr. Dune?

Sweeping the Dust Under the Rug? ;

 Instead of replying  to these particularsubjects, you are very EVASIVE sir Dune?!!!!. I am not bothered though, but other people  involved here may cast  their doubts on you as a former ," self installed"  MNCF officer, but have thrown up the towel early when a raging storm seems to be looming.
 Why . oh pls. Mr. Dune where are your  answers to those particulars facts raised here?. Howling  Sir will not do you any good, We are not those silly kids you know .. Where you one of those officerds concerned who have thrown their weights aound to your group that early, resulting to the banishment of peop;e?

 Why did you not give a  reply to  the US girl's reason for her resignation, as well as  among  similar cases of the others too? How about Ms Ambassadeurs?.

If only the posts here on the MNCF  were not deleted for public viewing, everyone can assess the true facts,. sir?. Then again , invoke your statement , once again that you are "cheap" for being involved here?. You may better say it as " I invoke personal privileges". or......"  May I iask permission first from Lord John.", before I say my piece.?

BTW , Mr. Dune, don't ask me who I am, as I don't bother to ask you a similar question  on yourself . You don't know me, ( and neither Lord John knows ), so don't believe / consider yourself that you are MUCH better off than me , in whatever level you may  think off , aside from Financial or Economic.

Got a problem or rather  you don't know how to create a Legal  entity, say a corporation or a  Foundation as you mentioned here that the process is quite long and tedious?. It only shows your are  naive to doing business in a legal way.  If not, I don't know why.

Mr. Dune,  It is  so easy to do that..... Just go to the SEC at EDSA and at their" Fast Lane Section", you can get a copy or, TEMPLATE to serve as your guide as  to what any corporation you may think of, For just a very minimal fee, dune? Or if you want, specifics, why not  ask for a copy of  all of Erap's Muslim Youth Foundation's Articles of Incorporation documents?,( that if it still exists  anyway?. It will take you only  a few hours including photocoying. huh???. You know some of these foundations are merely created for just fund raising and serve only as a ploy. We know that well.

So Mr, Dune  during your watch, there was actually  no MNCF in the first place. ? Nothing,  Nada.. as it was a Private Account?. Oh my goodness!! , But you all then was all crying in heaven's  sake for r contributions using this name MNCF which I only know now that .....it is Non Existent? You as an oficer has not done your duty!! It is a very DECEPTIVE action of you all officers!.
What do you do  say with  a check contribution payable in the name of MNCF?. You deposited it to the account of Tom, Dick and Jane?.

"Aywan ko kung may hanganan pa ito o may patutungunan pa  ba?"

[tatjana]

OH goodness Great, Lord  John has made so much rantling; all those BOASTING Lord John, I can only say : BOW!!!.

I was not mistaken to call you  in the first place... LORD.. Lord John, so Moneyed and so Blessed in life!!!. How very lucky and succeful life you have sir.!!!.  To you I say Amen.

Those travel  cost dear lord is based onl;y on yourself, or for one(1) person alone  and to exclude your family.. which is not a subject here, anyway but you mentioned it in high heavens to show to the world your moneyd stuff... ha?.  Not  to mention  other physical attributes on yourself and the family?

 "THE END DOES NOT JUSTIFY THE MEANS"

Believe you know what I am talking about on the above saying Sir John?.. Well. to be blunt, If your goal is decent and to help the nedy, do it in the proper way.  The way it is being undertaken now is  a suspect or create a ground for abuse ond corruption.. Fix it sir before it burst  right infront of your face ..

May I know who audits  Lord John's decisions on these PRIVATE funds?. Are you donors contented on  the present set up?

 Lord John you are really so well endowed financially, but is it proper to brag about these?, BY the way,  I am more inclined in a dutch treat that footing rhe bills on you. Anyway , I can still bother to breath fresh air and can  eat three square meals daily sans other contribuiton